ART WAR l 2D l Vajra l Oten

[oten]

Theme: Fantasy

Name: Mickael Mas
Email: mickael.dessin@gmail.com
Facebook: www.facebook.com/OtenDrawings

Hi everyone, I'm french, so my english will be a bit messy, sorry for this

Vajra is the incarnation of the thunder. She's followed by thunder and storm, and defend herself using them.

I want to see her as a thunder elemental.
I'll try to paint her as she appears in my head. I'll be grateful to you if I could get your advice and feedback. So feel free to say what you think, I'll enjoy reading you !

EDIT: new drawing at the 12th post

Here's the base of her body

Some ideas for her shoulders and her tail. Feel free to give your thoughts, even if I have my preferences, I can change my mind following your favorites

Thanks a lot for reading, I hope my entry will please you !
I'll add other wip with time

[sanguine]

I like what you've got so far.. It's nice to see you experimenting with different designs! I really like the ones with thigh spikes!

[Crayvv]

Cool character concept, she kinda reminds me of Dragon ball for some reason, probably because of the armor! Anyway keep going, your concept design is awesome!

[oten]

Hi, thank you very much
I'll add the tail after I improved it

Today I played with colors, here's some of the research

I have a little preference for the 2 first ( even if I like the 5th, it remind more the fire than the thunder in my opinion )

[oten]

Hey

Today, I worked on her weapon, and I thought about a vajra ( no kidding ). It's a kind of small staff with a dumbbell-ish shape. Well, if you are interested, wikipedia is your friend => https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vajra

I designed it to come with these 5 main ideas
The second one is thought to look like an eagle since this animal represent zeus, the thunder god

These shapes where a bit too raw, so I wanted to refine them.
Doing so, I found that the 2 first shapes looked like bows, and the 3 others like arrows' head.

I decided to forget about realistic arrows, lightning arrows fits better to the character, but I still need to pick a bow, so you can help me by choosing your favorite

Thanks again for reading

[oten]

Btw, I worked a bit on her raw color too!

[oten]

An off topic quick concept, just for fun and to change my mind, Vajra sci fi version :

---

Ok, back to the real Vajra, here's the background ( it can be change or improved later )

[oten]

HI!
Here's my improved and final drawing
( unless you've got some feedback , I'm always open )

I had to upload the final as a jpg, since as a png it was far too heavy, but I still have the png version if needed

Hope you like it

[yorieofthecastle]

Get ready for that feedback, boi!
I do like the image, but there is too much going on and not enough at the same time. What is doing? Is she floating? Where? What's that weapon, why is she not using it? What are all these lightning bolts and ice shards around her? Does she control them?
An image should make the viewer think, make them ask questions, but there should be answers as well, imo.
And what am I supposed to look at? There are so many bright white things, what is important? What should I care about? The image is very hard to read, but even if we focus only on the character.. well, she's just standing there.
You have a lot of very light values and a lot of very dark ones, but not that much in the middle. The eye gets tired quickly and needs areas of rest when looking at an image. You need to guide the viewer to the focal point, to the thing you want to show them.
Speaking of guiding, the image doesn't seem very united, there are lines going off in every direction possible. The vertical lightning bolts and the horizontal ice shard things are competing when they should be complimenting one another and most importantly, the character.
Here's my quick paint-over:

I tried to make the image flow better, but I can't say it's actually good. You've picked a very hard lighting situation with the vein-like lights on the character, the lightning bolts and the shards, which don't emit light themselves, but are very reflective. I tried to simplify it by removing the bolts, but it could definitely use more work, and more importantly - more thinking.
I did change the pose of the character a bit, but ideally she should be using the weapon, even if it's just for display and not actually functional, I don't really think your image has room for useless props. We have one shot at this contest, everything in the image has to have some purpose.

Here are the original and my modded version one next to the other, I hope you can see the difference, even if neither of them is best possible thing:

My final advice is to start over, there is a lot of time left.
I hope I was helpful in any way!

[oten]

@yorieofthecastle

Wow, what a feedback!
Thanks a lot for using your time writing this!

You opened my eyes, since I was drawing all days, I added so many highlight that I lost myself

I'll start from the beginning, the same character, but this time following your feedback.
I hope it'll be better and you'll like it this time!

Thanks again, your help is priceless

[Crayvv]

Damn man, you're really good at giving feedback and critics. We're so thankful to have someone like you here in the competition, you're appreciated a lot man!

[oten]

Hi & happy new year!

After an awesome feedback, I did another draw, hope it'll be better, feel free to criticize, I won't cry, even if you are raw

It's not finished yet

[andrewnimble]

Hey I like the pose and colors. I also like the concept - how your character looks is pretty cool. Also this new one has better values, which is a plus. Now.. On the other hand you are still struggling with the composition..
First of all when showing full body of your character it is really odd when you cut just a little piece of it as you did with the right foot. Also combined with the flowy lines it leads the viewer out of the image and that is not what you want. The other thing is the arrow - although its line is intersect with the bow, which leads the viewer back towards your character, the arrow is such a bright value, that it still dominant and whenever you have arrows pointing somewhere it naturally leads the eye to follow that direction.
The second thing is the storytelling, which is none in this case. We can see she's ready to fight, but where is she and who is she fighting? I know it can be difficult and that it probably took you a lot of time to illustrate your character again, but if you want to make the illustration more interesting, you should plan ahead. I want to suggest you a good way approach towards making composition and it's up to you if you want to use it or not. Try making several thumbnails with just 3 basic values. You can make like 10 or 20 of them, then pick 3 and work on them and add few more values, then pick your final one and start working for real.. This process is also when you can get the feedback on your composition. After you spend some hours in and add colors and everything, it is already too late for you and you're wasting your time, when you then try to start from scratch again..
In the end just a minor thing wich I have noticed after I already wrote everything.. when you want to shoot a bow, you should make sure to actually hold it.. I am talking about the gap between her fingers and the bow, try shooting a bow this way I have a bow myself and I can tell you it's not a good idea to hold it like this
I hope this was helpful in some way and that I am not too hursh. Keep it up! ^^

[yorieofthecastle]

The new image is heaps better than the previous! I really like the pose, the lighting's been cleared up, now the weapon is actually in use. Perfection may not be achievable, but I think we can get pretty darn close to it. With that being said;

I agree with @andrewnimble's critique. Composition definitely seems to be one of the weakest points of the picture. The values are waaaaaaay better, but could be touched up a bit and since you said the image is not done yet, Imma give you the benefit of the doubt that you knew they could be adjusted. I'd be willing to give the lack of an enemy a pass if we knew at least where this is taking place.

In terms of the composition, the way the leg is cut off is very weird indeed. That's a super easy fix, but instead of making the character smaller, I think it's better to make the canvas longer (in this case).

Now the character has breathing room and doesn't look like you've tried to squeeze her in but didn't have enough space.
Of course I can't do anything for the BG, that's solely up to you.
I have touched up the values a bit, but they need more work.
Aaand the foreshortening. I really do hate saying "this is wrong" and then not suggesting a way to fix it, but I couldn't foreshorten a limb properly even if my life depended on it. I did try tho, and now it looks a bit better, but it's still off. We should kidnap a professional and feed them water and stale crackers until we can foreshorten things for ourselves. xD

All in all, this image is a huge improvement from the last one and I can't wait to see the next update! ^3^

[oten]

@andrewnimble thank you for your feedback!
You're right, until now, I almost never drew thinking about composition.. so, yeah, it's a real struggle for me ^^'
But I'm doing my best, with all your advice.
I'll change the lines, they aren't working as I thought they'll do.
For the arrow... it's harder, but I'll try with a thinner one and without the /\ shape
I'll try this good approach for the background, since I'm not brave enough to throw this drawing away a second time.. xD
The storytelling's coming, I'm thinking about it right now! ^^

For the bow, I did archery for many years too, and they always told me to not hold the bow while bending it. Just pushing the handle with the palm is enough so, she won't hold the handle, but i'll redo her hand soon

Every feedback are useful, that's the only way to improve, you can hit me harder, I'll always thank you ^^

@yorieofthecastle thanks again, you're great :3
I'll keep adjusting the values, yep. But the hair are meant to be a light source so they are tricky to shade x_x'
For the background, sorry, but as I said sooner, I'll let the suspens a bit more~

I hate drawing feet... but since it looks weird, i'll draw it.. sorry, I'm lazy xD

Aaand the foreshortening.

Yeah... as a french guy, I don't even know how to pronounce this word in english..
But I know your feel, believe me. Let's stalk professional together! ^-^

Thanks again, both of you, I hope my drawing will be as good as your feedback

[oten]

Hi, here's a little update! ^^

I'm not used to draw background 8D
Feel free to say what you think about it

And, just an off topic question, what's your canvas average size?
because my file is as heavy as an anime... >.>'

[yorieofthecastle]

Maybe you could give the enemies different poses? Perhaps have them aim their weapons at the character/s?

I usually work on 2500/4000 canvases and just zoom to 200% for details. So far I haven't really needed something larger, but I don't think my pc would handle anything bigger anyways xD

[oten]

@yorieofthecastle
I was thinking the same for the 3 flying, and I'll redo their design too
For the moment, they are just a quick shape that I'll rework later ^^
( Andrew's advices to improve my composition :3 )

The horde on the ground and the 2 allies are easy to see? or is it hard to understand their posture? ( sorry, I'm struggling with my english, I hope you understood what I meant ^^' )

[yorieofthecastle]

The enemies on ground are noticeable enough.
The ally on the left could use some different colours tho, right now she blends a bit with the main character.

[HorizonDweller]

Haha, the anatomy kind of reminds me a little bit of my champion , good job