Ash - Art School Journey

[ashley.durnall1]

I'm going full steam ahead with Term 2 Anatomy! I assume that the end goal is to put everything together but i'm jumping the gun a little I want to solidify what i'm learning and put it to practise.

I'm managing to do these proportions and ears from imagination - I will try using reference for a few to see how that works out with my new knowledge.
I've found that I struggle with the head looking straight on. The proportions of the middle head just looks weird - I think it could be fixed by correcting the central line but i'm not sure. I'm going to check back in the video, but are there any methods anyone uses to better proportion the front-on head?

Ignore the disproportionate ears on the front-on head; I did them separately, and not all ears are drawn the same - I did have both on the canvas to try and reference but I got a bit impatient - working on this . I could've done it better if I measured properly.

I also added values and tried to give it a bit more shade. Overall, i'm massively happy here, I feel like the 3rd dimension is very visible here. It makes me more confident with adding values in the future - I may understand it more than I realised
I use the hard round brush with opacity pressure for sketching so I can be a bit lighter - I used the same brush to add the values to the ears.

[ashley.durnall1]

I need some advise.

I'm on Term 2 Anatomy and I'm fully stuck on noses. For whatever reason, I can't get noses down. I started on them today and my first attempt has completely stumped me.

Here's the attempt.

I followed along with the video, doing the same steps and adjusting for my drawing's differences. I'm not sure what happened, but it just because a blob of lines and grey xD

I'm possibly thinking that I got ahead of myself and should draw over some real noses to get a feel for the shapes maybe?

But for future attempts, how is the best way to approach noses? Are there any tips or tricks people use to help?

Any critique and help is appreciated here.
I don't want to fall at the hurdles - and I've found that the help I've gained from people here has made me learn so much faster than I was alone.

[ashley.durnall1]

I don't think I'm getting this.

Can someone help tell me where I'm going wrong? I feel like the bottom of the noses I draw are too big.
I follow the video, but somewhere in the mix my work deviates and ends up looking wrong. I attempted to draw a couple more, but I don't really know how to continue.
I even tried to draw over real noses, but I don't really understand how those boxes become a full nose.

This certainly feels like a giant brick wall in the way of progress. Maybe this method is not the best way for me? I don't quite know how to get past it - maybe neglect to draw the nose on my characters I know some people avoid drawing hands and feet, can you do the same with noses?

EDIT:
I've had another go, and it's definitely the bottom of the nose throwing me off. I had a bit of a revelation while rewatching the video for (I think) the 4th time and realised Marc doesn't take the bottom of the nose right down to the curve. This has helped a tiny bit. but I still think I need the help understanding it.

But is this better?

I don't know whether the underside of the nose should just abruptly end at the centre of the nose. It just feels wrong, though looking at it from a distance it could be the nostril hole, and not the central bit?

I think if i can figure out a way to confidently place the middle underside of the nose, I might have something closer to a nose.

[WeirdOwl]

Hi Ashley! I think you're on the right path, your last attempt is definitely closer. What helped me in my time, was imagining the underside of the nose as a perpendicular line to the middle line of the face. Sure, not all noses are straight like that, some curve up, some curve down even, but as a baseline it helped me visualize the rotation of the tip and the positioning.
Let me know if this doesn't make any sense, and I'll try to make a schematic of how I build it.

[ashley.durnall1]

I had a similar thought after looking at my own nose and re-watching the video. In practise though, i'm not sure if i've got it down. I did some free standing noses, which may or may not be the best thing to do

In each, i marked the perpendicular line and tried to follow it when adding the nostrils. I definitely don't understand the shading, so I did a couple without (maybe this helps see mistakes better).
I feel like there's multiple issues with them - mainly with the ball of the nose and the wings. I don't quite know how to get the three dimensional look with them, they just seem flat and the nostrils too big.

On a brain thinking level, I think I know what to do - I just can't actualise it. It may be useful to see how you do it.
I did try and figure out how to replicate one of the noses from the references I have, but I struggled a lot. Maybe it's easier to do it on a head?

I did a step-by-step process of how I have been drawing noses:

I don't think it looks necessarily bad, but it still feels flat (maybe) at the tip. I can't see how i'd add shade to make it look 3D.
Maybe this step-by-step will better to see where I'm going wrong, if I am

[WeirdOwl]

I think I'm starting to see your main issue: when you make the outlines, the tip of the nose is drawn flat, so it's very difficult to visualize and shade it round afterwards. Also, the nostrils don't land exactly flat with the middle of the nose.
Maybe this method will help you a little (it's more simplified and not as anatomically correct, but it could be a bridge for now)

[ashley.durnall1]

I think i've gotten somewhere, thanks to your help @WeirdOwl

Are these better?

I drew out the 3D trapezoid shape as I did in the step by step, but this time round, I added an ellipse onto the end to indicate the 'ball' of the nose. It made it easier to visualise - I even added extra lines when I needed to for some extra help.
Not super confident with the shading, but that's something else for me to work on

I can see why Marc mentions connections and overlapping. As I can't visualise things, I can't easily find the simplified shapes in objects, but just adding the ellipse to the trapezoid gave me a nose, I'm thinking this is the start of a great thing!!!

Thank you so much for helping with this

[WeirdOwl]

Much better! All you have left is curve the nostril a bit, and you'll be golden!

You are very welcome and keeps working, you're doing great progress.

[ashley.durnall1]

Ooo thank you so very much. I didn't expect you to go this far

I will definitely implement this into all of my future drawings!

[ashley.durnall1]

It feels like so incredibly long since I last posted D:

I finished the Anatomy 2 video and i'm working on getting the face down in my technique wheelhouse. Faces are super difficult.

I've had a couple attempts, but I've been taking more time to try and sort out my Master's Degree (which I'm still trying to sort).
Much like noses, I'm having some issues again. However, I do want to go back to the videos to run through it step by step.

These are first attempts at full faces - I've very little experience art wise so i'm proud of myself. I can see many areas I need to improve, but i'm not sure where to start.

One thing I know I'm finding difficult is keeping everything on the face on the same 'plane' and direction. The leftmost face emphasises what I mean here. I need a way to keep in mind the orientation of the face for the facial features
One of the main issues I notice is that I find I never know where to place the tip of the nose and it seems to look like it's not in the same direction. Maybe this is just my eye?

Are there any other things I could improve on/ways I can improve upon what I've got here? I'm going to continue working on faces until I feel a bit more confident with them.

In addition to advice/tips, how do you change this up to create other face structures? I don't quite understand how I can change the features to make the face more feminine, or have different characteristics. Is this something that just happens with time?

[Frygidal]

The head on the right is pretty nice, what you lack is just mostly perspective stuff, you need to draw some boxes and other figures in 3d space and train a lot of these heads with jaws, look at your drawing after applying some of liqufiy and transform tool to apply :

and it was you who draw it, not me remember, start always with basics because you will struggle more and more, good luck!

[BadRooster]

Digging the guitar.

[ashley.durnall1]

Thank you for the advice. I largely have spent my drawing sessions today drawing boxes in free perspective as well as 2 and 3 point perspective.
I think because perspective on simple shapes feels easier i've skipped over it a little, but after your advice I realise that easier doesn't mean much if you don't really understand it

I did try drawing a box to help with the planes, but I got a bit lost in the lines - though I was tired and didn't put much effort in. I'll have another go and see if I can get my head around it.

Edit: Here's another attempt:

Focusing on boxes for a bit has actually helped more. It definitely has a box-y look to it though but I can work to fix that. I tried to keep in mind the overall plane of the face - this helped me with the mouth and realising which parts would be higher than others.
For reference, this drawing is tiny xD So that's why the eyes are a bit off, I should've tried doing it bigger (for some reason i'm intimidated by working above a few pixels)

One area i'm still struggling with is the nose. I had to draw it out on it's own to try figuring it out (trying to follow the same perspective) because I'm finding I don't know how to add the second nostril and when to add the other nostril. Maybe real life reference will help here?

@BadRooster Thank you also It was purely a challenge to prove I could do it; it's weird but my friend that challenged me knew what I could do better than I did.

[ashley.durnall1]

This week I haven't really had much time for drawing on my tablet - its odd but I think a little break was necessary. I have, however, made sure to doodle in my sketchbook and on random bits of paper/post-it notes (it's funny because my .

I've also done a couple focused areas in my sketchbook, and I think I'm improving a little.
I don't know whether I understand mouths fully though unless they're at one or two angles.

I am doing my best to try and build up a visual library (which is difficult with Aphantasia), I've been studying random people's faces when I'm out of the house to try and learn. I may try to study some faces and do a couple draw over's to learn positioning.

I am also trying to draw and shade shapes in random orientations. I'm not sure how people do this effectively though as I get through a couple orientations and find myself unable to flip and draw shapes in ways to help me learn. Are there any methods you use to do this sort of thing?

Also, is there a trick to the pillars of the mouth? It's one of the many places I'm certain will give me flat faces. Any tips are appreciated

[Vonschlippe]

Hey Ashley,

Great work on the sketchbook - keep at it.

I'm not sure I get your question about drawing shapes in different orientations. Do you mean like drawing a box or an object several times with various 3D rotations as to view the same thing from different angles? Either way, being able to do this with a simple box is the gateway to drawing more complex forms from any point of view. Simply attempting it is good practice for now.

Where I think I can help is the pillars of the mouth. I see you render them as very solid planes, distinct from the lower lip, and with a hard exterior edge with a line. In reality, this is not the case. I've red-lined your last sketch to explain what I mean

The idea is that the lower lip is not a distinct volume in itself - it's more of a color/texture change that follows a single skin fold, which begins at the "pillars of the mouth". Not everyone has these features prominently on their face - feminine faces tend to have subdued pillars. Remember the following - there is only a SINGLE skin volume (or fold) to represent the lower half of the mouth. This fold tapers into the cheek very smoothly, and thus should not be outlined in any way. The structure is most visible at the center below the lower lip, where the volume is thickest.

Things to keep in mind
1 - do not outline the pillars - they are simply the exterior part of the skin fold that forms the lower lip, and it tapers off smoothly into the adjacent skin. The lower lip and pillars are the same structure.
2 - the outer lines of the lower lips are usually unnecessary - if shown, they are there to mark a color change rather than a different plane or volume.
3- less is more - you can often hint at the pillars just by putting a blob of shadow underneath the lower lip, above the ball of the chin.

[ashley.durnall1]

Thanks for the advice @Vonschlippe.
I think much of my drawing comes from replicating Marc's video - he does outline the bottom of the lips and in one section shades the pillars (though I noted he erased the outer edges to leave the render as you've done yourself).
I think, where faces are concerned, I've tried to go off of the memory of both the video and real life, which hasn't helped me out so much. Looking back at the video I see what you've also explained again I'm going to study actual faces and draw over them to learn proportion.

I'm still very unconfident drawing a full head, so similarly to the nose alone, I may post a full process in stages for critique. I think if I can add depth/shading correctly to my drawings this will help, so studies it shall be

When it comes to drawing shapes in different orientations, it is exactly as you suspect. I find that I can draw 3 or 4 different orientations before repetition.

[ashley.durnall1]

So I attempted to figure out the face a bit more by drawing over some images. It's definitely helpful and has given me some insight, so I'll continue breaking down the face in this way - but i'll take it further when I feel confident enough.

I tried my best here to not just trace over the images, but instead, follow Marc's method to construct the head. For the most part everything worked out fine and it's helped me understand the method a bit more. It's definitely given me help with noses, I don't always have to draw in the full second nostril - it's sometimes obscured by the bottom of the nose. Seeing how noses actually work in addition to @WeirdOwl's advise has given me more insights, and I'm eternally grateful for the advise given here I hope to return it one day.
I have been analysing more people's facial features in tv and whatnot and have seen exactly what @Vonschlippe demonstrated with the bottom lip. However, here I wanted to indicate where both the lips are for reference.

I also attempted to put into practise what i've picked up by drawing the eye of one of my references:

I think the bottom lid is possibly a bit rounder than it should be, and I guarantee that my shading is off (I'll get there ) but I feel like I can at least get references down with enough time. Imagination is going to be difficult D:

There's still areas I don't quite get, like how to identify where the chin ends (for the curved planar lines that go from the ear to the chin - if that's understandable?), or making sure the mouth is correct. I will have to actually attempt a full face drawing from reference.
Hopefully this is a bit more clear:
- For the chin, there's always a section at the most forward part of the chin that looks 'flatter' than the rest. I don't quite know how to find the two points when this 'flattness' ends. I know the chin isn't flat, but it's the easiest way to explain it (I feel like this is confusing D:)

• With the mouth, I can never seem to orient the philtrum correctly which ends up with mouths that look very weird (I don't know how to explain it, but it's evident in my previous post on 11th September). In these references, it looks more flat than I seem to draw it in. I may be putting more thought into this than I should, but it does help me place the top lip a little better when the angles are awkward.

I think the main thing i'm asking here is more for tips others have picked up from drawing faces - i'll be sure to post my own tips should I come across them.

I'm going to draw more from reference for a while to get a better idea. I have issues with the amount of time it takes to do just one (the guides I did took long enough), but I assume this gets faster the more I do it

[ashley.durnall1]

So my motivation from the last post dwindled due to sorting university stuff out for my Master's Degree.. I haven't done anywhere near as much as I wanted to do.

I'm at that point where I've lost my direction again. It always gets to the point of self-directed learning where I start to get lost. I begin to find frequently that I cannot identify how to progress and end up getting disheartened. I think that because I've wanted to learn how to draw/create digital art for so long, it has a large emotional impact on me.

Today I tried my hand at a head in 2 point perspective:

As a first attempt, i'm pleased with what has come out of this. I definitely need to work on a lot of things, but it looks like a face, and i'm proud of myself I don't quite know where to progress from this, all of my attempts may come out looking the same as this D:

I also drew one of my previous references (the hair was intimidating, so i left it out for now):

This took about 45 minutes, and multiple starting attempts. I'm not displeased, the proportions compared to the reference aren't too bad, and for my first proper attempt at a face, i'd say it's successful. I can't say I've captured the reference as I'd like, but I think some of that would come from shading and maybe the hair.
Other than that, i'm not sure how i'd go about manipulating the features. I used my 'wire mesh' from the previous post to help me out, but even still I struggled with getting it as I wanted.

Would it be better to focus on the separate parts of the face, or work on it as a whole?
Marc's video (Anatomy 2) focuses on the face separately, but I'm a little apprehensive of being able to put the pieces together once I'm confident. I've felt a little more confident with noses, ears and general head proportions, but putting them together not so much.

I appreciate any critique, and advice on my work so far, and also how to more effectively study and understand the anatomy.
My goal is to be able to draw my D&D characters and some other random ideas I get. I want to focus on character and creature design, and maybe add backgrounds to give them life. Reference is applicable (and I will use it lots), but I want to be able to understand how things work so I can go beyond my references.

[liviuc]

This is really inspirational. I’m impressed with your hard work and good results. I hope I can match your dedication - I’m moving into this stuff myself now.

[ashley.durnall1]

It's been a while. Such a while I considered making a new thread D: But I ended up realising that I should just keep this one alive

I've started my Master's Degree in Data Science and it did really mess with my ability to focus on drawing. As a result, I had a couple months drawing hiatus, which did upset me - I'm happy to be able to get back to it properly. I did some doodles that I was happy with, but other than that I've not done any drawing

I feared I'd lost progress, so I'm going a lot slower and trying to put more effort into learning each part. I'm really wanting to get the fundamentals down and be able to create things effectively when I feel confident enough to just go for it with my first real pieces.

I haven't begun watching the videos again yet, but I'm using what I've learned with gesture drawing. Despite having a couple months away, I don't feel like I've lost too much of what i'd developed previously.

Ignore the large space (It will be filled :P). The top left was a few weeks/months ago and everything else has been done over the past week or so.

I went over a few to strengthen the lines, but I'm pleased. So many of the gestures feel very apparent, and there not too much stiffness in the poses. I'm still not sure how to do 'loose' and flowy gestures yet - I'm not super flowy.

I'm also not confident with my lines, they're all scratchy and not nice. Is this a thing that just gets better with time? Or are there exercises I can do to train myself out of it - I don't want the bad habit.